Hope you caught the Reverend Joel Osteen on 60 Minutes last night. After the Patriots dismantled Jerry's pretenders, I stayed on CBS because I was interested in three of the four 60 Minutes pieces.
Before I get to Joel, let me recommend that you not take the Blackwater piece all that seriously. "Americans want to hear you say you're sorry." That's journalism? Then Erik Prince is allowed to say he never wants innocent civilians to die. Bring up the music. And...scene. For a more thorough piece of investigative journalism concerning this army of lunatics, go to www.iraqforsale.org. And as far as the Florence federal prison piece goes, could they have found a less sympathetic prison guard? That woman only needed a trailer and wrap-around shades to be the post-tornado interviewee in Gotebo, Oklahoma. "The inmates are needy." Needy? "They ask for extra toilet paper." Oh, heavens. Needy bastards. And we haven't got a square to spare... Again, there is much more to the story than 60 Minutes presented. There is another super max federal prison in Marion, IL. These are not nice places, and the idea that you would keep people from human contact only guarantees the development of additional pathologies. Imagine never being able to touch another person. Never.
Joel. Let me say that for the first time ever I'm an outsider to this conversation. I don't care that Joel is a heretic. And the fact that 60 Minutes trotted out Michael Horton only makes me more sympathetic to Joel. Maybe next week they can get D.A. Carson to talk about Lakewood. I've read some reviews online about the interviewer Byron Pitts. The reviews have all been very positive. Internet Monk called him "superb." How 'bout we go with a cast-off actor from the theater of the absurd? Over the top. Scowling. Contrived. Condescending. Why didn't he just let us know what church he attended? There is no way someone with no dog in the fight could have behaved the way Pitts did. His bias was all over his face. In his defense, I will say that I appreciate him understanding the theological issues better than most journalists.
Joel came off as nice, if a bit wide-eyed. The scene where they are checking out the shifting colors of the ceiling is classic: "Isn't that neat?" Neat? Who says neat anymore? I can't decide if that's really Joel, which is to say he's a rube that made it big, or if he's one of the best actors around. They definitely should not have shown the last few scenes in which Joel was playing football with the family. It was obvious he had no idea what to do; he fared a little better with the basketball. So, he's a family guy, works hard, loves people, cries when he talks about changed lives (it's odd that when Hybels cried during his interview, Christians talked about how passionate he was; I suspect Joel won't get the same courtesy), and seems to genuinely enjoy his life. And yes, he's gotten rich off the ministry. This strikes me as a degree of culpability issue though. I'm not sure how pastors who routinely make 50, 80, or 100 thousand or more a year get to criticize a guy who's making ten times that. If you're living off the church and you're making twice the annual salary of an average parishioner, you might as well put down your stone.
Joel practices the great American religion: entertainment. Sometimes entertainment is transformative, sometimes it's banal. Christians can criticize him all they want for watering down the Gospel, preaching prosperity, or being a heretic, but the bottom line is he's doing what most of their churches are doing; he's just doing it better. Entertainment has become the water in which the church worship machine swims. If Joel does it better, learn from him. Quit crying about it. If you think entertainment is awful, stop playing the game. Churches aren't going to do that though; it would cost them too many members. Think of it like a sports metaphor: if Joel is the top of the BCS rankings, don't bitch about him because your church isn't in the top 25. You're playing the same game; he's just better.
Greg,
Your last paragraph was one of the most clear, direct and correct statements I've ever heard you (or anyone, for that matter) make on the state of the current Church.
"...Christians can criticize him all they want for watering down the Gospel, preaching prosperity, or being a heretic, but the bottom line is he's doing what most of their churches are doing; he's just doing it better."
Wow. I'm not sure I've ever heard it put any better.
I honestly still don't know what to think about Joel. Success is almost a no-win situation, because we're conditioned to think that no one is supposed to like a Christain. Yet he seems to be refreshingly honest (maybe he is just acting, but if not, then I'm impressed) Christianity has become all about learning the list of do's and don'ts. The fact that Osteen is seemingly more concerned with truly helping people experience God's transforming power is rather amazing.
BTW, did you catch the part where Ramsey Yousef now claims to have become a Christian. I don't think a Muslims are allowed to do that are they?
Anyway, thanks for the great post to start of the week....
Posted by: Dallas Tim | October 15, 2007 at 09:37 AM
"Success is almost a no-win situation, because we're conditioned to think that no one is supposed to like a Christian."
DT--is being a Christian only proper if there is recognizable "success"? That's the entire point of Greg's post--in today's church in America, "Christianity" has been deconstructed to the point of not being relevant or "worthy" unless you have at least half a dozen timpany drums and a pastor of acting/artistic performance on staff. What next, Associate Pastor of Amusement and Gaming?
To quote a very good friend of everyone's on this site: the more a church begins to look like Disney or Wal-mart, the more it looks like . . . Disney or Wal-mart.
Osteen has bottled that "success" and made it the envy of every struggling (and not-so-struggling) health/wealth congregation (read: every congregation) in America. He has done it with his kick-the-dirt-golly-daddy-was-a-blessed-man-of-God schtick and it is flying off the shelves to Oprahesque proportions.
Posted by: dr dobson | October 15, 2007 at 10:23 AM
Dr. Dob.
I think we're making the same point.
I was just wondering if too much success should always be questioned.
Again, that may be, as you pointed out, dependant on what one means by "success."
Posted by: Dallas Tim | October 15, 2007 at 12:04 PM
Really? You really find Olsteen entertaining? I can't even imagine living a life that would allow me to find Olsteen entertaining.
(I CAN imagine what living a life that would allow me to find Olsteen entertaining would look like and what it would amount to - I can't imagine ME living that life.)
Posted by: michael | October 15, 2007 at 01:50 PM
Have read anything by Robert Jenson?
He kind of addresses this point...in a round about way
Posted by: padraic | October 15, 2007 at 02:12 PM
I skipped 60 Minutes; I gave up on broadcast TV news years ago. It seems like even a good number of the veteran anchors (who would have known better ten or fifteen years ago) have started acting like their most important consideration is the effect of their stories on the morale of American citizens. I suspect there are more important things than my personal feelings--I don't have the fortitude it takes to sift through a presentation that treats my reaction as its ultimate concern. That's the way you treat a distraught child, not a nation of adults.
Posted by: Leighton | October 15, 2007 at 03:09 PM
I'll admit that I am a closet Osteen fan. I was actually watching his 'show' (well, I guess technically it's a service) last night and thought of you Greg. Funny timing. Get over to our house soon. Please.
Posted by: Brooke | October 15, 2007 at 03:46 PM
Greg, I almost called you last night to see if you were watching that segment. I watched it myself and was...well let's just say I wasn't a very good Christian after that segment.
I have to agree with your point though. People can criticize Joel all they want, but if you can stomach about 15 minutes and watch other tv preachers on TBN or Daystar they are all peddling the same brown bag of crap. By the way I would recommend keeping that brown bag around so you can vomit in it after watching those two networks.
Sadly I was most impressed with the fact that he could bench press 300 pounds. I thought that was just "neat".
Even worse within a few days you will get a few people in here who will be upset because we were being critical of Joel, and we aren't being very good Christians, and they have never done research or studied anything that was taught to them and they have no idea that the snake oil, i.e. Prosperity Message, that is being peddled by Joel and the rest of the "RAH-RAH Charasmatics" is nothing but garbage. Oh I can't wait for them to show up because it's gonna be "neat".
Posted by: Adam Smithee | October 15, 2007 at 07:56 PM
Leighton -
What about the last bastion of decent terrestrial television: PBS?
Their "Frontline" series is pretty good.
Posted by: Phil | October 16, 2007 at 10:56 AM
Yeah, I like Frontline. I watch it over the web, so I sometimes forget it's part of a TV network. I just wish their investigative style were still mainstream, instead of the voice crying out in the wilderness.
Posted by: Leighton | October 16, 2007 at 01:37 PM